rogueonekink | DISCUSSION POST!

It's been two weeks since the movie came out and it's obvious RO has a waaaaay smaller fanbase than TFA. Even in terms of fic and kink meme activity, it's pretty small. I wonder why that is. Any theories?

Not sure, but maybe it has something to do with the fact that it's action-heavy and everyone dies. If you want to ship, mostly you're going to have to go pre-cannon for a handful of characters or completely AU. I personally struggle not to spend a page or two of writing justifying any AU (even simple ones) and that can put me off.

Another reason might be that the loads of characters in Rogue One got less screen time and therefore are harder to characterise in fic. It might take a while for established fanaons to come up before people feel comfortable writing them.

To be honest, I actually prefer not having any established fanon headcanon. I find popular headcanon is usually OOC or ruins the fandom/pairing/character for me since in my experience popular fanon tends to be completely opposite canon characterization. This is what ruined TFA fic for me (and what happens in a lot of large fandoms).

YMMV but I think the screen time we got in RO gave enough characterization to write fic. The movie did a pretty good job of getting personalities across in such a small amount of time.

I have a similar problem with AUs that still exist in the SW universe. With TFA there were little bits of downtime or possible moments for interactions between characters off screen while the movie was focused elsewhere and there really isn't much of that in RO and then everyone dies. I'm kind of having a hard time writing anything because of that.

I also can't help but wonder if there's a drop-off because there aren't any young white dudes to ship. Like, while I don't want to think that about the SW fandom, there is a lot more of Hux/Kylo than Finn/Poe, just looking at the tags on AO3. (And I'm not trying to hate on that ship at all. I've read my fair share of Hux/Kylo fic.) I hope it's not that though. It's just a worry I have.

I wouldn't think it's strictly a white dudes ship thing because in the early days of TFA Stormpilot and Reylo were the biggest ships and Kylux only came up later as the juggernaut. There was plenty of activity on the TFA kinkmeme even prior to the rise of Kylux. But Rogue One might lack the sticking power of the TFA fandom with absence of a young white boy slash option. Something, something time will tell.

Based on the popular ships right now, which according to AO3 are Jyn/Cassian and Chirrut/Baze, I'm wondering if that same thing will happen with Rogue One fic eventually. I don't think many people would have predicted kylux surpassing reylo and stormpilot in the early day of fandom.

I'm not sure what would surpass the current ships, though. Bodhi/Cassian seems pretty popular on this meme, but they don't have nearly as much fic on AO3, though I guess it's still early.

So who knows.

NAYRT

I think that has something to do with it, though it's strange because for awhile Finn/Poe and Kylo/Rey were the two big ships. Hux/Kylo came out of nowhere after the first burst of fic. I know some people were scared off from writing Finn/Poe because fandom got a little....intense, which I think is a shame. I know others who chose to write Hux/Kylo because it was the least wanky part of fandom at the time.

That said, it's not really uncommon for fandom. Unfortunately most fandoms default to young white dudes. Like you, I've shipped my fair share of those pairings, but those do tend to overshadow pairings with women or characters of color. I know a het pairing is the most popular right now, but I have no doubt that if there were two young white dudes in Rogue One, there'd be way more fic since that's fandom's m.o.

I do think maybe having to write everything as an AU might also work against the fandom. I don't mind it as much because it's a simple enough fix, but I know not everyone likes canon divergent or everyone lives AUs.

DA

I'd just like to say that I absolutely adored Finn/Poe but that sector of the fandom was so extraordinarily wanky and purity-policing that my interest in writing for them died. Which is a shame, yeah.

But I never got into Kylux. They have barely any screentime together, idk, I wasn't interested.

NA

I wasn't really part of TFA fandom so I''m curious what was the wank about? My impression was that Finn/Poe was a big pairing everyone was happy about.

AYRT

essentially, you couldn't write or draw anything without it being racist somehow. It got so bad that people ended up deleting their fics and art because of accusations and anon hate and "callout" posts. Everything had to be "pure".

I stopped creating Finn/Poe content simply because I didn't want to deal with the wank.

I just feel bad for people who were into reylo and seeing all the shit they would get, especially when a lot of them were just minding their own business and were completely cognizant of the fact that they were shipping a hero and a villain.

Whaaaaaaat. That's insane. I can see calling stuff out if it truly was racist, but the little I saw of TFA fandom at the beginning didn't seem to have that problem. But wow. I'm kind of shocked this happened.

And what do you mean by "pure?". Like no porn? No angst?

I did hear a lot about reylo shippers, and I do think it's a shame for people to attack shippers who aren't causing problem. It's not a ship I'd ever consider, but no one should get attacked for minding their own business.

Yeah, if you wrote porn you had to be REALLY careful about it bc like... there was so much nonsense about how if you wrote Poe as a top or flirtatious then that was fetishizing Latino men, but if you wrote Finn as a top then that was stereotyping Black men as "sexually aggressive". But if you wrote either of them as sexually inexperienced, then you were infantilizing/desexualizing POC. So you couldn't win no matter what porn you wrote. And if a semi-popular blogger decided a fic was "problematic" and posted about it, a bunch of their followers would go send the author hate. I can't make this shit up.

And yeah I don't even ship reylo but I found myself blocking a LOT of anti-reylo folks because they were everywhere on the stormpilot tag and I just wanted to look at Finn/Poe stuff in peace. Ship and let ship, folks, it's fiction.

Here, have a link explaining it in detail: https://fanlore.org/wiki/Star_Wars:_The_Force_Awakens

AYRT

I honestly think Finn/Poe would have the most fics on AO3 if people hadn't been scared away from writing it. I mean, there were definitely some issues going on in TFA fandom - like that Finn/Poe segregation AU or the Jewish!Kylo Nazi Kylux AU - but overall, it was pretty much the standard, "this is my view on X social issue, and if you don't agree 100%, you're racist/sexist/homophobic/bigoted".

I left TFA when fans of Kylo or Hux or Phasma were called KKK members or Nazis, when Finn/Rey shippers were called homophobic, and Finn/Poe shippers racist and sexist. I do believe fandom should be able to have discussions about race, gender, sexuality, and other issues, but sometimes I think fandom has a warped idea about safe spaces and social justice. It's one thing to call out stereotypes that are harmful, and another thing entirely to call someone racist because they prefer complex, plotty fic instead of fluffy cinnamon roll sap.

I like that it's a tinier fandom. It'd be nice if the kink meme was more active, but too much activity usually means a lot of similar prompts, or so many prompts that fills get lost in the shuffle.

I know a lot of people didn't connect to Rogue One they way they did to The Force Awakens, so that probably has something to do with it. I also think the nature of the ships has something to do with the smaller fanbase.

It seems to be closer to the main Star Wars kinkmeme/fics activity wise, I think it is probably for the best. I think the TFA fandom suffered from a lot of "migratory" fans who joined for the hype but slowly drifted out to other fandoms. While people who are writing for Rogue One are probably more long-term fans who have been around since before the film.

I know a lot of people found the characters flat and one dimensional or having no chemistry, which I totally get. It does come off as forced at times, and I'm still an it baffled as to why they cast some amazing actors only to underuse them.

So I think the lack of characterization and chemistry has led to lack of fic and interest. The first time I watched it I did t really come away wanting to see more of any ship because they told their stories and wrapped them up nicely. Even Cassian/Jyn didn't feel romantic to me, but I don't think that's what the movie was going for anyway.

DISCUSSION POST!

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